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	<title>Comments on: A note on complex sentences in Mark&#8217;s gospel</title>
	<atom:link href="http://ntresources.com/blog/?feed=rss2&#038;p=298" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298</link>
	<description>Dr. Rod Decker&#039;s blog for (mostly) New Testament-related discussion.</description>
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		<title>By: srunge</title>
		<link>http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298&#038;cpage=1#comment-224</link>
		<dc:creator>srunge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Nov 2008 14:23:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298#comment-224</guid>
		<description>Rod,

Your Mark 5 example is the also the longest string of circumstantial participles that I found in the doing my analysis for the LDGNT project. It was amazing to see Mark background that much action, leaving &quot;touch&quot; as the sole finite verb in the sentence. This ends up being the thematic key, the precipitating event, with Jesus asking who touched him. When I am asked &quot;What difference do participles make?&quot; this is one of the passages I highlight. I would agree that Mark is mistakenly undersold for his style, as is John. Hope to  meet you at the upcoming conferences.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rod,</p>
<p>Your Mark 5 example is the also the longest string of circumstantial participles that I found in the doing my analysis for the LDGNT project. It was amazing to see Mark background that much action, leaving &#8220;touch&#8221; as the sole finite verb in the sentence. This ends up being the thematic key, the precipitating event, with Jesus asking who touched him. When I am asked &#8220;What difference do participles make?&#8221; this is one of the passages I highlight. I would agree that Mark is mistakenly undersold for his style, as is John. Hope to  meet you at the upcoming conferences.</p>
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		<title>By: cwconrad</title>
		<link>http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298&#038;cpage=1#comment-223</link>
		<dc:creator>cwconrad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Nov 2008 13:03:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298#comment-223</guid>
		<description>Please note, Rod, that I said, &quot;may have more to do with ... &quot; That&#039;s not a firm judgment but a bare hypothesis. I do tend to be skeptical also about Papias&#039; account of the origin of Mark&#039;s gospel. But as the days pass, yesterday&#039;s naiveté is replaced by -- today&#039;s naiveté. What does seem clear to me (more or less) is that there are at least two distinct &quot;Stilhöhen&quot; in the extant gospel of Mark.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please note, Rod, that I said, &#8220;may have more to do with &#8230; &#8221; That&#8217;s not a firm judgment but a bare hypothesis. I do tend to be skeptical also about Papias&#8217; account of the origin of Mark&#8217;s gospel. But as the days pass, yesterday&#8217;s naiveté is replaced by &#8212; today&#8217;s naiveté. What does seem clear to me (more or less) is that there are at least two distinct &#8220;Stilhöhen&#8221; in the extant gospel of Mark.</p>
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		<title>By: Dr. Rod Decker</title>
		<link>http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298&#038;cpage=1#comment-222</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Rod Decker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Nov 2008 12:00:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298#comment-222</guid>
		<description>Thanks Carl. In regard to your comment that, 

&quot;the inelegance and crudity of some of the Marcan constructions may have more to do with the sources that Mark retains without redaction&quot;

I wish I was confident in some reasonably objective way/criteria for distinguishing sources. We can&#039;t just say, &quot;the rough stuff is source and the nice is Mark,&quot; for that would be merely a hypothesis--one which might explain (some/much), but which in itself has not been validated. Any ideas as to how we might provide warrant for such ideas?

It might be relevant to consider Papias&#039;s comments as possibly reliable external evidence for the composition of Mark. If so, we might postulate the rougher Greek as reflecting Peter&#039;s Galilean fisherman&#039;s speech and the other portions as more &quot;native Markan.&quot; I&#039;m not sure that works, but it&#039;s one possible factor to consider. (I think I&#039;ll make another blog post on the external evidence re Markan authorship and composition.)

I&#039;ll need to make some comment on this entire issue before I&#039;m finished, but I need to finish working inductively through the entire corpus and drafting the grammar/syntax notes before I&#039;m in a good place to make any overall assessments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Carl. In regard to your comment that, </p>
<p>&#8220;the inelegance and crudity of some of the Marcan constructions may have more to do with the sources that Mark retains without redaction&#8221;</p>
<p>I wish I was confident in some reasonably objective way/criteria for distinguishing sources. We can&#8217;t just say, &#8220;the rough stuff is source and the nice is Mark,&#8221; for that would be merely a hypothesis&#8211;one which might explain (some/much), but which in itself has not been validated. Any ideas as to how we might provide warrant for such ideas?</p>
<p>It might be relevant to consider Papias&#8217;s comments as possibly reliable external evidence for the composition of Mark. If so, we might postulate the rougher Greek as reflecting Peter&#8217;s Galilean fisherman&#8217;s speech and the other portions as more &#8220;native Markan.&#8221; I&#8217;m not sure that works, but it&#8217;s one possible factor to consider. (I think I&#8217;ll make another blog post on the external evidence re Markan authorship and composition.)</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll need to make some comment on this entire issue before I&#8217;m finished, but I need to finish working inductively through the entire corpus and drafting the grammar/syntax notes before I&#8217;m in a good place to make any overall assessments.</p>
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		<title>By: cwconrad</title>
		<link>http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298&#038;cpage=1#comment-221</link>
		<dc:creator>cwconrad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Nov 2008 11:23:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298#comment-221</guid>
		<description>This is very interesting and very good, Rod. I don&#039;t know whether you intend to offer stylistic comments in your textual commentary, but if you do, I wonder whether you&#039;ll have anything to say over the bad rap that Mark frequently gets as a composer of clear and intelligible Greek. In my younger and more naive days (any day before today is for me a younger and more naive day!) I have myself foolishly said that &quot;Mark&quot; couldn&#039;t successfully pass a first-year grad-school Greek composition class. Edward Hobbs led me to think, however, that the inelegance and crudity of some of the Marcan constructions may have more to do with the sources that Mark retains without redaction, while some longer narrative frames that must be Mark&#039;s own writing show good control of syntax and lucid constructions. I think these complex sentences you cite here argue in favor of such a view on Mark as a composer of Greek.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is very interesting and very good, Rod. I don&#8217;t know whether you intend to offer stylistic comments in your textual commentary, but if you do, I wonder whether you&#8217;ll have anything to say over the bad rap that Mark frequently gets as a composer of clear and intelligible Greek. In my younger and more naive days (any day before today is for me a younger and more naive day!) I have myself foolishly said that &#8220;Mark&#8221; couldn&#8217;t successfully pass a first-year grad-school Greek composition class. Edward Hobbs led me to think, however, that the inelegance and crudity of some of the Marcan constructions may have more to do with the sources that Mark retains without redaction, while some longer narrative frames that must be Mark&#8217;s own writing show good control of syntax and lucid constructions. I think these complex sentences you cite here argue in favor of such a view on Mark as a composer of Greek.</p>
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		<title>By: Bible Software Review Weblog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; To What End Bible Software?</title>
		<link>http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298&#038;cpage=1#comment-220</link>
		<dc:creator>Bible Software Review Weblog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; To What End Bible Software?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Nov 2008 10:51:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ntresources.com/blog/?p=298#comment-220</guid>
		<description>[...] it. So I am always on the look out for examples of practical applications. Today I found a nice one here. When I first read Rodney J. Decker&#8217;s question over at the Accordance Forums, little did I [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] it. So I am always on the look out for examples of practical applications. Today I found a nice one here. When I first read Rodney J. Decker&#8217;s question over at the Accordance Forums, little did I [...]</p>
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